ILA Podcast

Reflections on Jim Burns

Phronesis: Practical Wisdom for Leadership Podcast. Episode 198 - Dr. George Goethals - Reflections on Jim Burns. The Official Podcast of the International Leadership Association

With  Dr. George R. (Al) Goethals


ILA 2022 Lifetime Achievement Award Winner George (Al) Goethals shares a fascinating first-hand account of one of the beginnings of leadership studies, including the role of Jim Burns, Georgia Sorenson, and others.

Goethals shares how he got interested in the subject of leadership and the astonishing tale of how he and James MacGregor Burns met at Williams College in the early 1970s and began a dialogue that shaped the entire field of leadership and MacGregor Burn’s classic 1978 text.

The podcast continues with an intriguing look at the institutional beginnings of leadership studies, the role of Georgia Sorenson at the James MacGregor Burns Academy of Leadership at the University of Maryland, and the early conferences of the International Leadership Association.

Finally, Goethals discusses his most recent project, The Encyclopedia of Leadership Studies, published by SAGE in 2023.

About Dr. George R. (Al) Goethals

Dr. George R. (Al) Goethals is the E. Claiborne Robins Distinguished Professors in Leadership Studies Emeritus at the University of Richmond. Previously at Williams College he served as chair of the Department of Psychology, Acting Dean of the Faculty, Provost, and founding chair of the Program in Leadership Studies. Goethals’ published books include (among many others) The Quest for a General Theory of LeadershipHandbook of Heroism and Heroic Leadership, Heroes: What They Do and Why We Need Them (2010) and Heroic Leadership: An Influence Taxonomy of 100 Exceptional Individuals (2013, both with Scott T. Allison). More recently he authored Presidential Leadership and African Americans: “An American Dilemma” from Slavery to the White House (2015), Realignment, Region and Race: Presidential Leadership and Social Identity (2018), and The Romance of Heroism and Heroic Leadership (2019, with Allison). Goethals received the 2022 Lifetime Achievement Award from the International Leadership Association. 

Host Dr. Scott J. Allen

Scott Allen

Scott J. Allen, Ph.D., is the Standard Products—Dr. James S. Reid Chair in Management at John Carroll University. He is an associate professor and teaches courses in leadership, management skills, and executive communication. He is also a communications coach, consultant, author, podcast host, and entrepreneur. For almost two decades, he’s worked with clients to improve their leadership and communication skills. Learn more about Scott here.

About Phronesis

Phronesis: Practical Wisdom for Leaders offers a smart, fast-paced discussion on all things leadership. Scott and his expert guests cover timely, relevant topics and incorporate practical tips designed to help you make a difference in how you lead and live.

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