ILA Podcast

A Mountain With No Top

Phronesis: Practical Wisdom for Leaders

with Dr. Wiley “Chip” Souba


Dr. Wiley “Chip” Souba joins Scott to discuss his innovative approaches to teaching leadership and his conviction that most of the barriers to great leadership are not external, but within.

Quotes From This Episode

“I have come to believe that if you are not solid and square in here, you can’t be as effective as you would otherwise be. I think leadership is an activity that involves people and moving them and organizations forward to a better place. But it has to be anchored in here.”

“You’re always becoming a leader…you never become one, just like you never become a parent, you’re always becoming a parent.”

“You have to want people to do better than you.”

About Dr. Wiley “Chip” Souba

Wiley “Chip” Souba, MD is Professor of Surgery and Adjunct Professor of Medical Education at the Geisel School of Medicine at Dartmouth. Chip is recognized for his innovative approaches to teaching leadership and his conviction that most of the barriers to great leadership are not external, but rather within. Thus, his emphasis is on the inward journey of leadership. He lectures, conducts workshops, and teaches courses on leadership around the world. He has published extensively on diverse topics such as leading yourself, personal and organizational transformation, barriers to effective leadership, resilience, and the language of leadership. 

Dr. Souba has served as Dean of Medicine and Vice-President for Health Affairs at two universities, Dartmouth and Ohio State. He has also served as Chairman of the Department of Surgery at Penn State, Chief of Surgical Oncology at the Massachusetts General Hospital, and Professor of Surgery at University of Florida. Dr. Souba is a summa cum laude graduate of Muskingum College and an AOA graduate of the University of Texas Medical School in Houston, where he also did his general surgery training. During his surgical residency, Dr. Souba completed a fellowship in surgical research at the Brigham and Women’s Hospital and earned a Doctorate in Science in Nutritional Biochemistry at the Harvard School of Public Health. He subsequently completed a fellowship in Surgical Oncology at the MD Anderson Hospital and Tumor Institute in Houston, Texas. Dr. Souba’s clinical interests are in surgical oncology.

He has been regularly ranked as one of The Best Doctors in America by his peers and has been recognized for his clinical expertise by Boston Magazine. He was funded by the National Institute of Health for 20 years to study amino acid metabolism in catabolic diseases. He has published 350 articles in peer-reviewed journals, has served as Editorial Chair of American College of Surgeons Surgery, and was Co-editor of the Journal of Surgical Research for 20 years. 

Chip’s passion for developing leaders stems from his deep conviction that there is something about being human at this stage of our evolution that most human beings have not yet discovered or fully penetrated, the awareness of which would transform their lives and ultimately the world. He is committed to making that something available to as many people as possible. You can learn more about Chip’s writing and work at

Host Scott J. Allen

Scott Allen

Scott J. Allen, Ph.D., is the Standard Products—Dr. James S. Reid Chair in Management at John Carroll University. He is an associate professor and teaches courses in leadership, management skills, and executive communication. He is also a communications coach, consultant, author, podcast host, and entrepreneur. For almost two decades, he’s worked with clients to improve their leadership and communication skills. Learn more about Scott here.

About Phronesis

Phronesis: Practical Wisdom for Leaders offers a smart, fast-paced discussion on all things leadership. Scott and his expert guests cover timely, relevant topics and incorporate practical tips designed to help you make a difference in how you lead and live.